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	<title>Comments on: RE: Modern Art, and the Prejudice against Comics</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/</link>
	<description>Pregnant nun.  Holy Crap.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 01:34:45 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Nat</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-7262</link>
		<dc:creator>Nat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 11:46:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-7262</guid>
		<description>Hi! I happen to live in France and I figure what you said about comic artists being respected is true. We actually have a lot of comic artists around. Some of them make comics for children (which are still read by nostalgic adults who aren&#039;t considered as losers), and others make more &quot;adult&quot; comics (and I don&#039;t mean porn, I mean more elaborate drawings and stories on themes that aren&#039;t really of interest to children). Both are popular in their different way, but both are recognized as being, if not art, at least important parts of French culture.

I think the difference in recognition of a comic artist&#039;s work comes from the fact that some of the comics, like Tintin or Asterix, don&#039;t just target kids or teenagers, but more the whole family. Everybody knows them, and everybody is fond of them. For example, when I was little, my dad used to read Tintin comics to me, but he actually enjoyed reading them himself too. 
What&#039;s more, French and Belgian comics are often published with hardback covers, quality paper and are pretty expensive (it&#039;s at least 12€ for one book), which would make them a better support for &quot;artistic&quot; contents, at least in the public&#039;s mind. 

Sorry if my English is a bit rusty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi! I happen to live in France and I figure what you said about comic artists being respected is true. We actually have a lot of comic artists around. Some of them make comics for children (which are still read by nostalgic adults who aren&#8217;t considered as losers), and others make more &#8220;adult&#8221; comics (and I don&#8217;t mean porn, I mean more elaborate drawings and stories on themes that aren&#8217;t really of interest to children). Both are popular in their different way, but both are recognized as being, if not art, at least important parts of French culture.</p>
<p>I think the difference in recognition of a comic artist&#8217;s work comes from the fact that some of the comics, like Tintin or Asterix, don&#8217;t just target kids or teenagers, but more the whole family. Everybody knows them, and everybody is fond of them. For example, when I was little, my dad used to read Tintin comics to me, but he actually enjoyed reading them himself too.<br />
What&#8217;s more, French and Belgian comics are often published with hardback covers, quality paper and are pretty expensive (it&#8217;s at least 12€ for one book), which would make them a better support for &#8220;artistic&#8221; contents, at least in the public&#8217;s mind. </p>
<p>Sorry if my English is a bit rusty.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-7180</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 16:12:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-7180</guid>
		<description>Nice- I learned something interesting!  Ikeda-san, eh?

Also... you don&#039;t have that professor&#039;s contact information do you?  You could sent your post to him.  You could also post his picture here so that those of us who draw/publish our own works might make a special appearance with a similar character... This is the traditional response of authors of popular works to idiots who cross them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice- I learned something interesting!  Ikeda-san, eh?</p>
<p>Also&#8230; you don&#8217;t have that professor&#8217;s contact information do you?  You could sent your post to him.  You could also post his picture here so that those of us who draw/publish our own works might make a special appearance with a similar character&#8230; This is the traditional response of authors of popular works to idiots who cross them.</p>
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		<title>By: JoeSchwartz</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6945</link>
		<dc:creator>JoeSchwartz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 23:43:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6945</guid>
		<description>reading both rants of yours, I immediately thought of bill watterson and his opinions of comics as art. Great minds think alike, I suppose....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>reading both rants of yours, I immediately thought of bill watterson and his opinions of comics as art. Great minds think alike, I suppose&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: lucinos</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6943</link>
		<dc:creator>lucinos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 19:33:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6943</guid>
		<description>That reminds me the story of a now known scientist who realised in school that the explanation about how planes fly the teacher was teaching was wrong. He insisted that this was not right and when the teacher did not paid attention he made some paper planes to demonstrate. He was punished for making paper planes in classroom.  Of course he was right but the teacher ridiculed and punished him and never even paid attention to what he was trying to say. 

School is not a good place to think different.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That reminds me the story of a now known scientist who realised in school that the explanation about how planes fly the teacher was teaching was wrong. He insisted that this was not right and when the teacher did not paid attention he made some paper planes to demonstrate. He was punished for making paper planes in classroom.  Of course he was right but the teacher ridiculed and punished him and never even paid attention to what he was trying to say. </p>
<p>School is not a good place to think different.</p>
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		<title>By: Mayhem</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6921</link>
		<dc:creator>Mayhem</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 18:53:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6921</guid>
		<description>http://www.abominable.cc/2008/06/11/false-prophet/
I don&#039;t think anyone can look at something like this and say that it&#039;s not art. Webcomics are a medium of expression for the common person&#039;s uncommon thoughts, many of which can be astounding, but elusive. People try to share the beauty of these gems of their imagination to everyone willing to appreciate them, and this sharing encompasses many forms: storytelling, music, performance, and visual art. The style of the art is simply an aspect of the individual&#039;s personality, and is sometimes secondary to the idea that is being conveyed. People who deride someone&#039;s style of art are deriding the artists themselves, and also all those who use that style to spread their messages. Thus, its not just prejudice against webcomics, its prejudice against the people who write webcomics. Intolerance is intolerance, regardless of form, just like art is art. People need to open their minds a little.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.abominable.cc/2008/06/11/false-prophet/" rel="nofollow">http://www.abominable.cc/2008/06/11/false-prophet/</a><br />
I don&#8217;t think anyone can look at something like this and say that it&#8217;s not art. Webcomics are a medium of expression for the common person&#8217;s uncommon thoughts, many of which can be astounding, but elusive. People try to share the beauty of these gems of their imagination to everyone willing to appreciate them, and this sharing encompasses many forms: storytelling, music, performance, and visual art. The style of the art is simply an aspect of the individual&#8217;s personality, and is sometimes secondary to the idea that is being conveyed. People who deride someone&#8217;s style of art are deriding the artists themselves, and also all those who use that style to spread their messages. Thus, its not just prejudice against webcomics, its prejudice against the people who write webcomics. Intolerance is intolerance, regardless of form, just like art is art. People need to open their minds a little.</p>
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		<title>By: stocktone</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6915</link>
		<dc:creator>stocktone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 13:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6915</guid>
		<description>I was fortunate enough to spend a little more than a year living in Belgium way back in the mid 80&#039;s. Talk about immersion in art! The churches with their religious paintings and sculptures, the museums with their collections, Rubenshuis in Antwerpen, and the comics everywhere.

I still have stacks of Suske en Wiske, Asterix, Storm, and others. I told people I bought them to help me learn Dutch (or Flemish, if you prefer), but the fact is, I just loved reading them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was fortunate enough to spend a little more than a year living in Belgium way back in the mid 80&#8242;s. Talk about immersion in art! The churches with their religious paintings and sculptures, the museums with their collections, Rubenshuis in Antwerpen, and the comics everywhere.</p>
<p>I still have stacks of Suske en Wiske, Asterix, Storm, and others. I told people I bought them to help me learn Dutch (or Flemish, if you prefer), but the fact is, I just loved reading them.</p>
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		<title>By: Astarielle</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6893</link>
		<dc:creator>Astarielle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 11:52:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6893</guid>
		<description>I quite agree with you, but on another medium. I consider video games to be art. A blending of the visual and audio mediums, and interactive to boot.

But, people enjoy putting others down to make themselves seem bigger. To shake up a quote from Aesop: &quot;People will often applaud the same old thing and scorn new thought&quot;

And honestly, you bring up Manga? Manga and Anime is an odd thing, as you can go from something you would give a seven year old child to something an adult would sit down and read. That is art as well, but since it&#039;s cartoon, heaven forbid a mature adult would watch or read that, Simpsons aside.

In short, I hate people because of things like this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I quite agree with you, but on another medium. I consider video games to be art. A blending of the visual and audio mediums, and interactive to boot.</p>
<p>But, people enjoy putting others down to make themselves seem bigger. To shake up a quote from Aesop: &#8220;People will often applaud the same old thing and scorn new thought&#8221;</p>
<p>And honestly, you bring up Manga? Manga and Anime is an odd thing, as you can go from something you would give a seven year old child to something an adult would sit down and read. That is art as well, but since it&#8217;s cartoon, heaven forbid a mature adult would watch or read that, Simpsons aside.</p>
<p>In short, I hate people because of things like this.</p>
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		<title>By: ZeoViolet</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6875</link>
		<dc:creator>ZeoViolet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Feb 2010 11:11:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6875</guid>
		<description>@Mandy:  Teachers like this and worse do exist.  I&#039;ve had two teachers as a kid who set out to make my life miserable and I&#039;m not talking from the POV of a spoiled kid whose teacher exercised reasonable discipline restraint.  I&#039;m so sorely tempted to name names I can&#039;t see straight.

My fourth grade teacher in Utah in particular, as I was not only subject to her humiliating abuse but I witnessed her slapping other students in the face and she let the other students bully me and the one time I ever dared ask her for help against their torment, she stood me in front of the class and basically told me I was worthless and would amount to nothing.

And by the way, I was the top student in the class grades-wise.  When my parents called her in a fury she told them the same thing.  That I wasn&#039;t worth anything.

It was nearly twenty years ago now and she was this little old thing with scoliosis who also cried in class and tried to make us feel sorry for her, so she&#039;s probably dead by now and I hope she&#039;s burning in Hell.  She put scars on a ten year old child that have lasted the rest of her life.  If it hadn&#039;t been for my fifth grade teacher in Idaho who sensed what was wrong and saved me (as I was on the edge of suicide) I&#039;d not be here right now.

Teachers can be this cruel.  The fifth grade teacher in question was truly an angel in disguise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Mandy:  Teachers like this and worse do exist.  I&#8217;ve had two teachers as a kid who set out to make my life miserable and I&#8217;m not talking from the POV of a spoiled kid whose teacher exercised reasonable discipline restraint.  I&#8217;m so sorely tempted to name names I can&#8217;t see straight.</p>
<p>My fourth grade teacher in Utah in particular, as I was not only subject to her humiliating abuse but I witnessed her slapping other students in the face and she let the other students bully me and the one time I ever dared ask her for help against their torment, she stood me in front of the class and basically told me I was worthless and would amount to nothing.</p>
<p>And by the way, I was the top student in the class grades-wise.  When my parents called her in a fury she told them the same thing.  That I wasn&#8217;t worth anything.</p>
<p>It was nearly twenty years ago now and she was this little old thing with scoliosis who also cried in class and tried to make us feel sorry for her, so she&#8217;s probably dead by now and I hope she&#8217;s burning in Hell.  She put scars on a ten year old child that have lasted the rest of her life.  If it hadn&#8217;t been for my fifth grade teacher in Idaho who sensed what was wrong and saved me (as I was on the edge of suicide) I&#8217;d not be here right now.</p>
<p>Teachers can be this cruel.  The fifth grade teacher in question was truly an angel in disguise.</p>
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		<title>By: ZeoViolet</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6874</link>
		<dc:creator>ZeoViolet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Feb 2010 11:05:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6874</guid>
		<description>Isn&#039;t the first teacher out there to go out and say to an expansive child &quot;Such and such isn&#039;t really art&quot;.

Well then I suppose Piccaso or Da Vinci really isn&#039;t art either.  You call reproducing people&#039;s faces art?  They&#039;re just faces!/sarcasm

Or painting a nude model or a still-life bowl of fruit isn&#039;t art either.  You&#039;re just painting what you see for no discernable reason/more sarcasm

In other words, teachers like these have probably inhibited countless artists that might have otherwise become famous if they hadn&#039;t had their dreams crushed early on, and thus turn off the more artistic side to their brains and sadly settle into a career in a cubicle in those large corporate buildings.

These teachers think they &quot;know&quot; what art is and that their view is the only one that matters.  Screw that.  If it were true, all art would be totally alike anyways and there&#039;d be no depth to the field.  The allure of art is not only diversity, it is endless expression and the ability of the human mind to endlessly breach new areas where we don&#039;t otherwise go.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t the first teacher out there to go out and say to an expansive child &#8220;Such and such isn&#8217;t really art&#8221;.</p>
<p>Well then I suppose Piccaso or Da Vinci really isn&#8217;t art either.  You call reproducing people&#8217;s faces art?  They&#8217;re just faces!/sarcasm</p>
<p>Or painting a nude model or a still-life bowl of fruit isn&#8217;t art either.  You&#8217;re just painting what you see for no discernable reason/more sarcasm</p>
<p>In other words, teachers like these have probably inhibited countless artists that might have otherwise become famous if they hadn&#8217;t had their dreams crushed early on, and thus turn off the more artistic side to their brains and sadly settle into a career in a cubicle in those large corporate buildings.</p>
<p>These teachers think they &#8220;know&#8221; what art is and that their view is the only one that matters.  Screw that.  If it were true, all art would be totally alike anyways and there&#8217;d be no depth to the field.  The allure of art is not only diversity, it is endless expression and the ability of the human mind to endlessly breach new areas where we don&#8217;t otherwise go.</p>
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		<title>By: Mystic Amri</title>
		<link>http://www.sisterclaire.com/blog/re-modern-art-and-the-prejudice-against-comics/comment-page-1/#comment-6862</link>
		<dc:creator>Mystic Amri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Feb 2010 17:46:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sisterclaire.com/?p=2316#comment-6862</guid>
		<description>I agree with you on a lot of it, but I think you actually did get the point of viewing moldy piss... as a previous commenter explained about shock art... you just didn&#039;t realize it at the time. Would be very interesting to revisit the subject with your idiot teacher about how you did get the point... the art is meant to shock your sensibilities. However, I wish your teachers would understand the vary thing they preach... art is subjective. Comics are considered art. I wonder what your teacher would say about political cartoons... those are clearly not meant for children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you on a lot of it, but I think you actually did get the point of viewing moldy piss&#8230; as a previous commenter explained about shock art&#8230; you just didn&#8217;t realize it at the time. Would be very interesting to revisit the subject with your idiot teacher about how you did get the point&#8230; the art is meant to shock your sensibilities. However, I wish your teachers would understand the vary thing they preach&#8230; art is subjective. Comics are considered art. I wonder what your teacher would say about political cartoons&#8230; those are clearly not meant for children.</p>
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